Gurutech
Oct 26, 06:44 PM
On the video front, crushing video down to mp4 files is a two stage process which each use 3-4 cores. Hosing an 8-core Mac Pro will be no problem. Those of you who think that 8-cores is a lot and crazy have no experience with multi-core applications and the idea of running multiple instances of even single core applications simultaneously. You are going to have to begin to RETHINK how you execute your workflow - i.e. the ORDER in which you initiate processes - to get the most bang out of an 8-core Mac Pro and to begin learning how to get more work done in far less time than you do today.
Thank you for both those posts. I have felt pretty alone on these 8-core threads thus far. Glad to finally see someone else who understands and can explain so well why 8-cores is still not going to be enough joining in on these discussions.
Any of you who don't think a 16-core Mac Pro will be a hit in a year can really only be into word processing. :p
Mac Pro is only true desktop offering from Apple. That's the problem.
Not that many individuals really want that much power.
However, they do intensive enough tasks requiring more power that exceeds what iMac can offer. The price and power ratio of iMac is just not enough.
Apple really needs something between "Pro" and "Consumer".
If iMac offered the ability to work as monitor, I wouldn't be disappointed by this much.
This is getting old already, but what I need is a decent Conroe Desktop with around 1500 USD price tag.
Thank you for both those posts. I have felt pretty alone on these 8-core threads thus far. Glad to finally see someone else who understands and can explain so well why 8-cores is still not going to be enough joining in on these discussions.
Any of you who don't think a 16-core Mac Pro will be a hit in a year can really only be into word processing. :p
Mac Pro is only true desktop offering from Apple. That's the problem.
Not that many individuals really want that much power.
However, they do intensive enough tasks requiring more power that exceeds what iMac can offer. The price and power ratio of iMac is just not enough.
Apple really needs something between "Pro" and "Consumer".
If iMac offered the ability to work as monitor, I wouldn't be disappointed by this much.
This is getting old already, but what I need is a decent Conroe Desktop with around 1500 USD price tag.
leekohler
Apr 23, 09:45 AM
I have no problem admitting I'm an Atheist and saying "there is no god" in the real world. Seeing how people react shows me who my real friends and family are. And fortunately no one close to me gives a crap that I'm Atheist.
Same here. Everyone at work knows too.
Same here. Everyone at work knows too.
Travisimo
Mar 18, 11:10 AM
Meh... I use MyWi occasionally, meaning only once or twice every TWO months.
Now I would spend an extra $5-10 a month if ATT offered tethering with a 5-10 Gigabyte total data cap on both phone and tethering usage. Spending an extra $25+ to be on a capped 2-4GB plan is BuL*Sh&^ if it means that I have to give up my unlimited plan as well as unrestricted 3G via My3G.
This. I wouldn't mind paying a bit more for tethering, but the $20/mo extra or nothing is really unacceptable. For those of us who only tethering sporadically, it's really a waste of money paying $20/mo. If the carriers really want an extra revenue stream from tethering, they should have different options available.
I would easily pay $5-10 more a month for 1GB of tethering data, and for those who want 2+ gigs for tethering, then $20/mo is fine. They really need a lower option.
Now I would spend an extra $5-10 a month if ATT offered tethering with a 5-10 Gigabyte total data cap on both phone and tethering usage. Spending an extra $25+ to be on a capped 2-4GB plan is BuL*Sh&^ if it means that I have to give up my unlimited plan as well as unrestricted 3G via My3G.
This. I wouldn't mind paying a bit more for tethering, but the $20/mo extra or nothing is really unacceptable. For those of us who only tethering sporadically, it's really a waste of money paying $20/mo. If the carriers really want an extra revenue stream from tethering, they should have different options available.
I would easily pay $5-10 more a month for 1GB of tethering data, and for those who want 2+ gigs for tethering, then $20/mo is fine. They really need a lower option.
pmz
Mar 18, 09:20 AM
They offer an unlimited data plan for one device. There's nothing illegal about it. By sharing that data with other devices you are very clearly and very simply breaking the contract.
Please point that out in the contract, know it all.
Guess what, it isn't there.
Go look up the word Unlimited in the dictionary. Internalize and understand it. Come back here when you're done. Then come into a court room. Id like to sit back watch you (as I will eventually be watching AT&T) dance around the clear and concise definition of the word.
I've engaged in long, drawn out discussions with my legal pals about this very issue for several years, and they all agree it would completely impossible for AT&T to get out of court unscathed over this word "Unlimited"
Most of you people don't grasp the significance of the word in this case, which is not at all surprising given the crowd. (young and/or naive).
Most also think that because AT&T includes fine print in a contract, they can enforce it however they wish...which of course is a laughable fantasy to anyone who has sat through the first day of contract law.
Please point that out in the contract, know it all.
Guess what, it isn't there.
Go look up the word Unlimited in the dictionary. Internalize and understand it. Come back here when you're done. Then come into a court room. Id like to sit back watch you (as I will eventually be watching AT&T) dance around the clear and concise definition of the word.
I've engaged in long, drawn out discussions with my legal pals about this very issue for several years, and they all agree it would completely impossible for AT&T to get out of court unscathed over this word "Unlimited"
Most of you people don't grasp the significance of the word in this case, which is not at all surprising given the crowd. (young and/or naive).
Most also think that because AT&T includes fine print in a contract, they can enforce it however they wish...which of course is a laughable fantasy to anyone who has sat through the first day of contract law.
adamfilip
Sep 20, 11:54 AM
The hard drive is just to store files while it outputs them to the tv
much easier to cache on the hard drive then play. rather then stream constantly. it also makes it more reliable and less prone to interference
Since there are no inputs on this thing it wont be a PVR
much easier to cache on the hard drive then play. rather then stream constantly. it also makes it more reliable and less prone to interference
Since there are no inputs on this thing it wont be a PVR
mcmarks
May 2, 12:19 PM
A couple of points:
- No computer for which the user can write or install programs will ever be free of Malware (nor, to my knowledge, has the "malware free" term ever been applied to the Mac OS by anyone actually familiar with computer security). All I have to do is write a script that formats your hard drive, call it ReallyFunGame, thereby deceiving you into downloading it and running it, and poof. Malware at its most basic. (Apple addresses this issue with the App Store reviews for iOS apps, but even there, their review is not sufficient to eliminate all possibility of malware). So, the actual presence of malware is no surprise, nor has it ever been. The defense against these types of attacks are user education and OS design (which will be a compromise between usability and security). Personally, I find the compromises on the Mac less annoying than their counterparts on Windows. Furthermore, the frequent inscrutable dialogs on Windows in general cause a certain level of desensitization to all dialogs for the least savvy users undermining their value on Windows because users get used to just clicking through things they don't understand.
- The far more dangerous computer security problem, as has been mentioned in this thread a bit, is viruses (including worms which are a subset) because they can propagate and cause harm without user knowledge and intervention. This new piece of malware is not one of those (as far as I can tell). To my knowledge, Mac OS X remains a more secure operating system because there are no known viruses that have propagated in the wild that attack it. Now, if the same can be said for Windows 7 (I don't know whether it can or not), then it would be equally secure. Is it?
- No computer for which the user can write or install programs will ever be free of Malware (nor, to my knowledge, has the "malware free" term ever been applied to the Mac OS by anyone actually familiar with computer security). All I have to do is write a script that formats your hard drive, call it ReallyFunGame, thereby deceiving you into downloading it and running it, and poof. Malware at its most basic. (Apple addresses this issue with the App Store reviews for iOS apps, but even there, their review is not sufficient to eliminate all possibility of malware). So, the actual presence of malware is no surprise, nor has it ever been. The defense against these types of attacks are user education and OS design (which will be a compromise between usability and security). Personally, I find the compromises on the Mac less annoying than their counterparts on Windows. Furthermore, the frequent inscrutable dialogs on Windows in general cause a certain level of desensitization to all dialogs for the least savvy users undermining their value on Windows because users get used to just clicking through things they don't understand.
- The far more dangerous computer security problem, as has been mentioned in this thread a bit, is viruses (including worms which are a subset) because they can propagate and cause harm without user knowledge and intervention. This new piece of malware is not one of those (as far as I can tell). To my knowledge, Mac OS X remains a more secure operating system because there are no known viruses that have propagated in the wild that attack it. Now, if the same can be said for Windows 7 (I don't know whether it can or not), then it would be equally secure. Is it?
eric_n_dfw
Mar 19, 10:46 PM
You're all far too willing to accept the RIAA's iron grip over downloading music. Apple's DRM is disgusting - but you want to say "shut it down! or our prices will go up! or they'll make the DRM worse!" Well, you've got to do better than that - because they owe it to us to sell a better product. I want to own my music - I know the paradigm is new, I know it's a virtual product any way you slice it, but DVD Jon is doing the right thing, and we need to send a message.They owe it to us? The only people Apple owes anything to is their shareholders.
greenstork
Sep 12, 06:30 PM
Honestly though, who would want to stream HD??
1st, if the iTV did support HD, apple would "probably" have to sell HD content - and like hell I'm downloading a 9GB movie!!
2nd, HardDisk space disappears fast enough as it is...!
3rd, Why??? I have an HDTV and I barely see the difference between DVDs and 720p HDTV... (1080i is another matter).
Just because you can't see the difference between 480p and 720p doesn't mean that other people can't. I think this distinction is like night and day, but quality is subjective, I'll give you that.
1st, if the iTV did support HD, apple would "probably" have to sell HD content - and like hell I'm downloading a 9GB movie!!
2nd, HardDisk space disappears fast enough as it is...!
3rd, Why??? I have an HDTV and I barely see the difference between DVDs and 720p HDTV... (1080i is another matter).
Just because you can't see the difference between 480p and 720p doesn't mean that other people can't. I think this distinction is like night and day, but quality is subjective, I'll give you that.
Liquorpuki
Mar 14, 08:50 PM
That might be my point.
What's your point? Circular reasoning?
That's like arguing the problem with medicine is that the patients are diagnosed by doctors
The problem with education is the students are taught by teachers
etc
What's your point? Circular reasoning?
That's like arguing the problem with medicine is that the patients are diagnosed by doctors
The problem with education is the students are taught by teachers
etc
Alaerian
Apr 11, 11:03 AM
The only real advantage, aside from aesthetics, macs have over PC is more user friendly video/music editing. Speaking from experience here,
you can do the same on a PC, but it's slightly more difficult.
Unless you're buying some old/bad brand, a PC will normally give you greater hardware capabilities and you can always dual boot or just only use the Mac OS.
Of course, it's speaking about games, but that also doubles as video/music editing capability.
seriously, stop spreading crap like this. You make it plainly obvious that you have never actually used a mac. Or, that you're a 20-something kid who values your precious soul-sucking video games above all else.
I'm sorry if YOU can't see any value in a mac - you aren't looking very hard. Try loading OSX on your pc. Go ahead. I'll wait. Oh, make sure it is full functionality too. I want gestures, I want full printing and network support, everything. You say you have it? Prove it. Give me screen shots, video with audio, etc.
I'm sorry, but I loathe posts like yours. If you are so anti-mac, then good for you. Enjoy your world, but stay the hell out of ours.
you can do the same on a PC, but it's slightly more difficult.
Unless you're buying some old/bad brand, a PC will normally give you greater hardware capabilities and you can always dual boot or just only use the Mac OS.
Of course, it's speaking about games, but that also doubles as video/music editing capability.
seriously, stop spreading crap like this. You make it plainly obvious that you have never actually used a mac. Or, that you're a 20-something kid who values your precious soul-sucking video games above all else.
I'm sorry if YOU can't see any value in a mac - you aren't looking very hard. Try loading OSX on your pc. Go ahead. I'll wait. Oh, make sure it is full functionality too. I want gestures, I want full printing and network support, everything. You say you have it? Prove it. Give me screen shots, video with audio, etc.
I'm sorry, but I loathe posts like yours. If you are so anti-mac, then good for you. Enjoy your world, but stay the hell out of ours.
.Andy
Apr 24, 10:32 PM
And just to be clear, I DID NOT make a 35 on the ACT my Junior year of high school, and I am not on scholarship to a top 25 university.
happy now? :cool:
An intellectual heavy weight right here in Macrumors! Who would have thought it!
happy now? :cool:
An intellectual heavy weight right here in Macrumors! Who would have thought it!
OllyW
Apr 13, 07:24 AM
Wow all this fuss over a piece of software, It's not a hardware or even a OS release :confused:
How dare they.
It doesn't even run on the iPad or iPhone. :rolleyes:
How dare they.
It doesn't even run on the iPad or iPhone. :rolleyes:
firestarter
Mar 13, 02:49 PM
NO nuclear.
Problem is that you (or I) don't get to choose who uses nuclear.
- We can't stop Russia using unsafe reactors, or having poor security around them.
- We can't stop nuclear programs in India, Pakistan, Iran etc.
- We can't stop countries like Japan building power stations on fault lines.
All we can decide is whether we build them ourselves. We have a very real fuel crisis that manifests itself in war and terrorism, and will only get worse.
We can build our own nuclear power stations based on modern designs, in well guarded facilities away from seismic activity. If we choose not to, we face the worst of both worlds... we have all the downside of 'bad nuclear power' elsewhere coupled with the worsening ramifications of an oil crisis.
Problem is that you (or I) don't get to choose who uses nuclear.
- We can't stop Russia using unsafe reactors, or having poor security around them.
- We can't stop nuclear programs in India, Pakistan, Iran etc.
- We can't stop countries like Japan building power stations on fault lines.
All we can decide is whether we build them ourselves. We have a very real fuel crisis that manifests itself in war and terrorism, and will only get worse.
We can build our own nuclear power stations based on modern designs, in well guarded facilities away from seismic activity. If we choose not to, we face the worst of both worlds... we have all the downside of 'bad nuclear power' elsewhere coupled with the worsening ramifications of an oil crisis.
dante@sisna.com
Sep 12, 06:38 PM
Wow, a TON OF YOU totally miss the iTV purpose, to stream content FROM YOUR MAC! That's why no tuner, no storage, no anything!! Does Airport Express have storage, an antenna, etc?!? NO!!!
I love this! I want one today! I'm going to get a huge HD, maybe two of them and start my stored media collection on my G5 that I can wirelessly access in my HT room from the iTV's wireless remote!! I love it!! Music, Family photos in a slide show, eyegato to record HD programs!! Awesome!!!
This so rocks and will make a ton of money for Apple! I can't wait, this is truly what I've been looking for as there's no HDMI out on my G5!!
Exactly. Bingo. You've got the vision.
I love this! I want one today! I'm going to get a huge HD, maybe two of them and start my stored media collection on my G5 that I can wirelessly access in my HT room from the iTV's wireless remote!! I love it!! Music, Family photos in a slide show, eyegato to record HD programs!! Awesome!!!
This so rocks and will make a ton of money for Apple! I can't wait, this is truly what I've been looking for as there's no HDMI out on my G5!!
Exactly. Bingo. You've got the vision.
Popeye206
Apr 21, 09:03 AM
So are you going to tell me that paying for tethering ON TOP OF DATA YOU ALREADY PAID FOR is fair? Data is data is data... 4gb is 4gb no matter how I use it. Tethering cost are a joke!:mad: /end rant
You are joking right?
Fair or not, it's not Apple's fault. It's the carriers who have imposed this structure and probably fair. They do have to be able to support the extra data traffic if tethering was just open for anyone without paying. Personally, I think it's a waste anyway. At home it's WiFi... on the road it's my iPhone or I find WiFi if I need it for my laptop which is not hard to do.
Anyway... like it or not, it's not a free service today. Is it fair? I don't think so either and I think in the long run phone companies will bundle it in with the data packages. As well as having multiple devices assigned to the same plan so you can have one data plan that your smart phone and tablet can share.
But for now... it is what it is and if you're not paying for it, well, what can I say... good for you.
You are joking right?
Fair or not, it's not Apple's fault. It's the carriers who have imposed this structure and probably fair. They do have to be able to support the extra data traffic if tethering was just open for anyone without paying. Personally, I think it's a waste anyway. At home it's WiFi... on the road it's my iPhone or I find WiFi if I need it for my laptop which is not hard to do.
Anyway... like it or not, it's not a free service today. Is it fair? I don't think so either and I think in the long run phone companies will bundle it in with the data packages. As well as having multiple devices assigned to the same plan so you can have one data plan that your smart phone and tablet can share.
But for now... it is what it is and if you're not paying for it, well, what can I say... good for you.
Sydde
Mar 15, 06:40 PM
Somewhere I think I read that Fukushima Dai-ichi was just a few months away from final retirement of the entire facility after twice its designed lifetime. But there almost certainly must be spent fuel rods in all the basins, since fuel changes are done at least as often as 18 months and spent fuel takes two to four years to cool enough to be safely moved offsite. The fuel still contains enough U-235 to produce considerable heat from just decay, but internal pollutants reduce its ability to contribute in a reactive core. Presumably, spent fuel is not considered to be able/likely to generate a critical event (neutron flux is too compromised by pollutants) so it would not require such sturdy containment as would a reactor.
To me, this operation looks slightly slipshod, almost like brinkmanship. Pushing nuclear systems even half way to their limits seems like too risky.
To me, this operation looks slightly slipshod, almost like brinkmanship. Pushing nuclear systems even half way to their limits seems like too risky.
stompy
Apr 14, 03:36 PM
, are you sure? free, (almost) trouble free,
Agreed. All the little things add up quickly.
I like to do is to come in here and be reminded of some of the misconceptions I had when I first started switching over 5 years ago.
Yep. People often confuse bias with knowledge. I'm guilty as well.
We all know how Macs look nowadays (iMac, Mini, Macbooks, etc) and with the possible exception of the Mac Pro, none of them look much like the 1990s era Mac Quadra 800. Meanwhile, if you want to see something that looks like this today, it's readily available from Dell, HP, and half a dozen other "mini tower" PC makers. Wow.
My company just replaced a co-worker dead desktop with this:
http://i.dell.com/das/dih.ashx/232x232/das/xa_____/global-site-design%20WEB/a9c356c6-fafb-1634-c73b-34d50ab45516/1/OriginalJPG?id=Dell/Product_Images/Dell_Client_Products/Workstations/Fixed_Workstations/Precision/Precision_T3500/right_facing/us-11-22-shipsfast-500x500-t3500.jpg
Well, it's utilitarian. Some would argue that they want a computer, not a sculpture. Ok, but there are reasons behind every object designed. This object says "cheap. cheap. cheap."
That ancient form factor is one thing I don't miss after switching. It's like somebody on the PC side hit the "pause" button when they got their 1994 mini tower PC design completed and all these years later still I see more mini towers than any other PC form factor but I see very few Macs with this ancient form factor.
At the end of your post, you mention needs and tastes and I must admit that industrial design figures prominently in my tastes since switching to Apple gear. Even if the OS were equal (which they are not), I want stuff that doesn't take up more room than necessary, isn't noisier or hotter than necessary and looks good.
On a checklist, those things don't seem like much, but I agree: when you put it on your desk, it all matters (some things, obviously, more than others).
Agreed. All the little things add up quickly.
I like to do is to come in here and be reminded of some of the misconceptions I had when I first started switching over 5 years ago.
Yep. People often confuse bias with knowledge. I'm guilty as well.
We all know how Macs look nowadays (iMac, Mini, Macbooks, etc) and with the possible exception of the Mac Pro, none of them look much like the 1990s era Mac Quadra 800. Meanwhile, if you want to see something that looks like this today, it's readily available from Dell, HP, and half a dozen other "mini tower" PC makers. Wow.
My company just replaced a co-worker dead desktop with this:
http://i.dell.com/das/dih.ashx/232x232/das/xa_____/global-site-design%20WEB/a9c356c6-fafb-1634-c73b-34d50ab45516/1/OriginalJPG?id=Dell/Product_Images/Dell_Client_Products/Workstations/Fixed_Workstations/Precision/Precision_T3500/right_facing/us-11-22-shipsfast-500x500-t3500.jpg
Well, it's utilitarian. Some would argue that they want a computer, not a sculpture. Ok, but there are reasons behind every object designed. This object says "cheap. cheap. cheap."
That ancient form factor is one thing I don't miss after switching. It's like somebody on the PC side hit the "pause" button when they got their 1994 mini tower PC design completed and all these years later still I see more mini towers than any other PC form factor but I see very few Macs with this ancient form factor.
At the end of your post, you mention needs and tastes and I must admit that industrial design figures prominently in my tastes since switching to Apple gear. Even if the OS were equal (which they are not), I want stuff that doesn't take up more room than necessary, isn't noisier or hotter than necessary and looks good.
On a checklist, those things don't seem like much, but I agree: when you put it on your desk, it all matters (some things, obviously, more than others).
deannnnn
Oct 7, 06:09 PM
Competition is gooooood.
dumb terminal
May 6, 02:42 AM
I challenge you to walk down the west side, anywhere... but take 9th avenue from say... the 57th St to the mid 30's. Just get in a cab. Make a phone call in regular traffic. I'd be willing to wager that at least 75% of the time you drop a call, once, if not twice during that trip. It happens to me nearly every day.
Heck, I work in an office in the Flatiron District, and on my work iPhone, it is literally an act of god if your call lasts longer than two minutes. I get slightly better times at home in Brooklyn (Prospect Heights), but I'm averaging about 5-6 dropped calls during the day. It's frustrating (and embarrassing at the same time) when I lose a call with a client, and after calling them back, they ask "Are you on AT&T?" And not to mention the absolutely atrocious data speeds.
Strangely, my (personal) Verizon Blackberry has never had a problem anywhere in NYC. Hmm :rolleyes:
Heck, I work in an office in the Flatiron District, and on my work iPhone, it is literally an act of god if your call lasts longer than two minutes. I get slightly better times at home in Brooklyn (Prospect Heights), but I'm averaging about 5-6 dropped calls during the day. It's frustrating (and embarrassing at the same time) when I lose a call with a client, and after calling them back, they ask "Are you on AT&T?" And not to mention the absolutely atrocious data speeds.
Strangely, my (personal) Verizon Blackberry has never had a problem anywhere in NYC. Hmm :rolleyes:
pmz
Mar 18, 09:20 AM
They offer an unlimited data plan for one device. There's nothing illegal about it. By sharing that data with other devices you are very clearly and very simply breaking the contract.
Please point that out in the contract, know it all.
Guess what, it isn't there.
Go look up the word Unlimited in the dictionary. Internalize and understand it. Come back here when you're done. Then come into a court room. Id like to sit back watch you (as I will eventually be watching AT&T) dance around the clear and concise definition of the word.
I've engaged in long, drawn out discussions with my legal pals about this very issue for several years, and they all agree it would completely impossible for AT&T to get out of court unscathed over this word "Unlimited"
Most of you people don't grasp the significance of the word in this case, which is not at all surprising given the crowd. (young and/or naive).
Most also think that because AT&T includes fine print in a contract, they can enforce it however they wish...which of course is a laughable fantasy to anyone who has sat through the first day of contract law.
Please point that out in the contract, know it all.
Guess what, it isn't there.
Go look up the word Unlimited in the dictionary. Internalize and understand it. Come back here when you're done. Then come into a court room. Id like to sit back watch you (as I will eventually be watching AT&T) dance around the clear and concise definition of the word.
I've engaged in long, drawn out discussions with my legal pals about this very issue for several years, and they all agree it would completely impossible for AT&T to get out of court unscathed over this word "Unlimited"
Most of you people don't grasp the significance of the word in this case, which is not at all surprising given the crowd. (young and/or naive).
Most also think that because AT&T includes fine print in a contract, they can enforce it however they wish...which of course is a laughable fantasy to anyone who has sat through the first day of contract law.
spicyapple
Sep 26, 12:55 AM
8 cores ought to be enough for anybody. true, what would you do with extra cores? simply overkill.
drevvin
May 18, 11:38 AM
drevvin: I don't know where you get your "facts" from, but this is utter B.S. according to everything my friends and I have experienced.
Other carriers are going to have just as much "network congestion" with the other smartphones they're starting to put on their systems (Android based platforms with "true web browsers", etc.). So if your statement was accurate, we'd see a surge of complaints from Verizon customers, since they got the HTC Hero and Incredible phones. We don't....
Furthermore, the dropped call issue has LONG been an issue for AT&T, no matter which phone you use with them! One of my friends had a Razr and a Blackjack phone on AT&T, and got an iPhone after that. He had the same number of call drops with any of the 3 phones while he was with them -- usually in the same places where their signal was inadequate.
Words like "horrible" are relative... What one person considers horrible, someone else will consider acceptable. But I think it's clear that AT&T is not one of the "better" providers. I have a laundry list of issues with them, including their latest screw-up ... issuing me a VISA rebate card that's not possible to activate, because they didn't set it up properly. (I'm supposed to enter the last 4 digits of my acct. number as my PIN to activate it by phone or over the web, but it won't accept them!) They're also notorious for screwing up my billing by not sending me a bill one month, and then billing me for 2 consecutive months - if I don't proactively sign into the web and pay them first. They're FAR more expensive than some of their competitors for basic voice service, despite the relatively lousy coverage. And even the rollover minutes are subject to cancellation under all sorts of conditions, including when you decide to go from a more expensive plan to a less expensive one or fail to use them up in a 1 year period of time.
An over-saturation of data usage on a cellular network should cause issues with poor DATA performance, but should have NO bearing on dropped calls on the VOICE side. I'd be relatively ok with occasional poor data performance, because that's of secondary importance to me, really. You can always retry a download or wait a little longer for an email to pull in. But the VOICE side needs to be pretty bulletproof. You can't recover from dropped calls without redialing the phone.... AT&T seems to be playing a lot of games of promising data network improvements in response to people's complaints of VOICE issues, hoping they're ignorant of the way the network works.... (Voice issues are more expensive for them to fix since it usually means new towers have to be put up, vs. possibly just increasing some back-haul bandwidth to an existing tower.)
Ok just to reference your statement about data using seperate channels and what not I guess you are not privy to the technology used in cell towers, congestion is caused as a cell tower can only handle so many requests, DATA or VOICE.....So fyi Data requests can congest and cause problems with voice even on the Un Touched Super Squeeky Clean power known as Verizon's network.....and again it mostly boils down to the lack of experience in Apple's Iphone which I myself use but I understand that if I wanna use a phone just for voice I would not use the Iphone I would go with Motorola or Nokia but because I wanna have a (Phone, Camera, PDA, Mp3 Player, Internet and Email Portal, Game Device,) I use the Iphone and don't complain when my voice suffers at the cost of having the ability to do all that. But thats just me.
Other carriers are going to have just as much "network congestion" with the other smartphones they're starting to put on their systems (Android based platforms with "true web browsers", etc.). So if your statement was accurate, we'd see a surge of complaints from Verizon customers, since they got the HTC Hero and Incredible phones. We don't....
Furthermore, the dropped call issue has LONG been an issue for AT&T, no matter which phone you use with them! One of my friends had a Razr and a Blackjack phone on AT&T, and got an iPhone after that. He had the same number of call drops with any of the 3 phones while he was with them -- usually in the same places where their signal was inadequate.
Words like "horrible" are relative... What one person considers horrible, someone else will consider acceptable. But I think it's clear that AT&T is not one of the "better" providers. I have a laundry list of issues with them, including their latest screw-up ... issuing me a VISA rebate card that's not possible to activate, because they didn't set it up properly. (I'm supposed to enter the last 4 digits of my acct. number as my PIN to activate it by phone or over the web, but it won't accept them!) They're also notorious for screwing up my billing by not sending me a bill one month, and then billing me for 2 consecutive months - if I don't proactively sign into the web and pay them first. They're FAR more expensive than some of their competitors for basic voice service, despite the relatively lousy coverage. And even the rollover minutes are subject to cancellation under all sorts of conditions, including when you decide to go from a more expensive plan to a less expensive one or fail to use them up in a 1 year period of time.
An over-saturation of data usage on a cellular network should cause issues with poor DATA performance, but should have NO bearing on dropped calls on the VOICE side. I'd be relatively ok with occasional poor data performance, because that's of secondary importance to me, really. You can always retry a download or wait a little longer for an email to pull in. But the VOICE side needs to be pretty bulletproof. You can't recover from dropped calls without redialing the phone.... AT&T seems to be playing a lot of games of promising data network improvements in response to people's complaints of VOICE issues, hoping they're ignorant of the way the network works.... (Voice issues are more expensive for them to fix since it usually means new towers have to be put up, vs. possibly just increasing some back-haul bandwidth to an existing tower.)
Ok just to reference your statement about data using seperate channels and what not I guess you are not privy to the technology used in cell towers, congestion is caused as a cell tower can only handle so many requests, DATA or VOICE.....So fyi Data requests can congest and cause problems with voice even on the Un Touched Super Squeeky Clean power known as Verizon's network.....and again it mostly boils down to the lack of experience in Apple's Iphone which I myself use but I understand that if I wanna use a phone just for voice I would not use the Iphone I would go with Motorola or Nokia but because I wanna have a (Phone, Camera, PDA, Mp3 Player, Internet and Email Portal, Game Device,) I use the Iphone and don't complain when my voice suffers at the cost of having the ability to do all that. But thats just me.
wdogmedia
Aug 29, 01:01 PM
Come on, people, let's cut Greenpeace some slack, here. Their fanaticism only goes to certain lengths...the reason they protest Apple and other U.S. businesses is because if they actually protested in places where pollution was a major issue (like China), they'd all get shot. :)
Blue Velvet
Mar 27, 05:26 PM
But no one here has proved that Nicolosi is an unreliable representative of his field.
Sorry, but that's not how it works.
You expressed approval for his findings, you were the one who explicitly made him a topic of conversation. I and Gelfin asked you, based precisely on what, knowing full well the disreputable reputation he and his organisation has and the damage that he has done to many people... every major professional organisation in the behavioural sciences disagrees with him. Pointing out the core belief behind his philosophy, you seemed ignorant of it, yet somehow approved of his findings.
No-one in this conversation is a clinical psychologist or a psychiatrist, so they have to lean on reputable sources. The Surgeon General of the United States is just one example of a medically and scientifically reliable voice. And somehow, that's not good enough? Well, there's more:
No major mental health professional organization has sanctioned efforts to change sexual orientation and most of them have adopted policy statements cautioning the profession and the public about treatments that purport to change sexual orientation. These include the American Psychiatric Association, American Psychological Association, American Counseling Association, National Association of Social Workers in the USA, the Royal College of Psychiatrists, and the Australian Psychological Society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_for_Research_%26_Therapy_of_Homosexuality#Position_of_professional_organization s_on_sexual_orientation_change_efforts
Why don't you tell us precisely why all these organisations are wrong and why NARTH and their ilk are right, since you claim to understand and agree with their findings?
Sorry, but that's not how it works.
You expressed approval for his findings, you were the one who explicitly made him a topic of conversation. I and Gelfin asked you, based precisely on what, knowing full well the disreputable reputation he and his organisation has and the damage that he has done to many people... every major professional organisation in the behavioural sciences disagrees with him. Pointing out the core belief behind his philosophy, you seemed ignorant of it, yet somehow approved of his findings.
No-one in this conversation is a clinical psychologist or a psychiatrist, so they have to lean on reputable sources. The Surgeon General of the United States is just one example of a medically and scientifically reliable voice. And somehow, that's not good enough? Well, there's more:
No major mental health professional organization has sanctioned efforts to change sexual orientation and most of them have adopted policy statements cautioning the profession and the public about treatments that purport to change sexual orientation. These include the American Psychiatric Association, American Psychological Association, American Counseling Association, National Association of Social Workers in the USA, the Royal College of Psychiatrists, and the Australian Psychological Society.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_for_Research_%26_Therapy_of_Homosexuality#Position_of_professional_organization s_on_sexual_orientation_change_efforts
Why don't you tell us precisely why all these organisations are wrong and why NARTH and their ilk are right, since you claim to understand and agree with their findings?